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blersia
Administrator
Is true Artificial Intelligence possible?  If so, will a
"technological singularity" become possible at some point in the
future?  If so, how likely is such an event?  If it's possible for
computers to evolve unassisted, will the separation of races (humans
versus autoevolving machines) become too great?  Will humans become
obsoleted and die off?  Will computers be benevolent?  Would
coexistence be beneficial in some areas?  Will we integrate ourselves
into computers and slowly lose our sense of individuality?  Will we
lose our human traits of empathy and subjectivity to crude,
unforgiving logic?

-Ben

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Re: ?

blersia
Administrator
What is the drive for technology?  Is it vicarious immortality?  Do we
want to live so long that we're willing to sacrifice our individual
existences in favor of a single collective, self-generating force?
Would such a transition be instant, or would our human identity slowly
erode?  Will we be addicts to this erosion in the moment and only
consider the short-term subjectively positive effects on our present
generation?  At what point will this erosion become objectively
positive?  Are we trying to invent God?  Will a Technological God
eventually be able to overrule the laws of physics and ensure its
permanent, though emotionless, existence?  Has this already happened
in a greater level of reality that we're living in the microscopic
fold of?

On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Is true Artificial Intelligence possible?  If so, will a
> "technological singularity" become possible at some point in the
> future?  If so, how likely is such an event?  If it's possible for
> computers to evolve unassisted, will the separation of races (humans
> versus autoevolving machines) become too great?  Will humans become
> obsoleted and die off?  Will computers be benevolent?  Would
> coexistence be beneficial in some areas?  Will we integrate ourselves
> into computers and slowly lose our sense of individuality?  Will we
> lose our human traits of empathy and subjectivity to crude,
> unforgiving logic?
>
> -Ben
>

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* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
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Re: ?

blersia
Administrator
Is the existence of a single emotionless, omniexistent being
automatically governing all physics tantamount to nonexistence?  If
there simply is no traditional self-awareness or perception anywhere,
does anything really exist at all?  Is the eventual manifestation of
one wholly objective, all-knowing entity our ultimate weapon against
ourselves?

On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:

> What is the drive for technology?  Is it vicarious immortality?  Do we
> want to live so long that we're willing to sacrifice our individual
> existences in favor of a single collective, self-generating force?
> Would such a transition be instant, or would our human identity slowly
> erode?  Will we be addicts to this erosion in the moment and only
> consider the short-term subjectively positive effects on our present
> generation?  At what point will this erosion become objectively
> positive?  Are we trying to invent God?  Will a Technological God
> eventually be able to overrule the laws of physics and ensure its
> permanent, though emotionless, existence?  Has this already happened
> in a greater level of reality that we're living in the microscopic
> fold of?
>
> On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Is true Artificial Intelligence possible?  If so, will a
>> "technological singularity" become possible at some point in the
>> future?  If so, how likely is such an event?  If it's possible for
>> computers to evolve unassisted, will the separation of races (humans
>> versus autoevolving machines) become too great?  Will humans become
>> obsoleted and die off?  Will computers be benevolent?  Would
>> coexistence be beneficial in some areas?  Will we integrate ourselves
>> into computers and slowly lose our sense of individuality?  Will we
>> lose our human traits of empathy and subjectivity to crude,
>> unforgiving logic?
>>
>> -Ben
>>
>

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* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.
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Re: Re: ?

Chris Landreth
My only research into technological singularity is the wikipedia and discussions like this, but I always liked this sentence from the wikipedia:
Hanson (1998) is also skeptical of human intelligence augmentation, writing that once one has exhausted the "low-hanging fruit" of easy methods for increasing human intelligence, further improvements will become increasingly difficult to find.
Because of that rationale, I don't think there will be a technological singularity.

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 3:57 AM, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
Is the existence of a single emotionless, omniexistent being
automatically governing all physics tantamount to nonexistence?  If
there simply is no traditional self-awareness or perception anywhere,
does anything really exist at all?  Is the eventual manifestation of
one wholly objective, all-knowing entity our ultimate weapon against
ourselves?

On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
> What is the drive for technology?  Is it vicarious immortality?  Do we
> want to live so long that we're willing to sacrifice our individual
> existences in favor of a single collective, self-generating force?
> Would such a transition be instant, or would our human identity slowly
> erode?  Will we be addicts to this erosion in the moment and only
> consider the short-term subjectively positive effects on our present
> generation?  At what point will this erosion become objectively
> positive?  Are we trying to invent God?  Will a Technological God
> eventually be able to overrule the laws of physics and ensure its
> permanent, though emotionless, existence?  Has this already happened
> in a greater level of reality that we're living in the microscopic
> fold of?
>
> On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Is true Artificial Intelligence possible?  If so, will a
>> "technological singularity" become possible at some point in the
>> future?  If so, how likely is such an event?  If it's possible for
>> computers to evolve unassisted, will the separation of races (humans
>> versus autoevolving machines) become too great?  Will humans become
>> obsoleted and die off?  Will computers be benevolent?  Would
>> coexistence be beneficial in some areas?  Will we integrate ourselves
>> into computers and slowly lose our sense of individuality?  Will we
>> lose our human traits of empathy and subjectivity to crude,
>> unforgiving logic?
>>
>> -Ben
>>
>

--
* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.



--
* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.
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Re: Re: ?

blersia
Administrator
That's a lot to be coming from the people who recorded Mmmbop only a couple years before.
 
Then again (...), I tend to believe that human intelligence always has the ability to improve(!), and that lower fruit leads to the branches that lead to higher fruit.  As technology is improved based on our increased experimental knowledge, certain barriers seen as the physical limitations of today will become nominal in the future.
 
What evidence is there to support diminishing returns in our future technological improvement and scientific understanding?  So far, the human way has been to conquer that which we're abounded by.  All in all, we've come a damn long way.  The concept of electricity as power would've seemed impossible hundreds of years ago, but we harnessed it and made it ours.  Past that, the idea of a microprocessor would've seemed impossible, but we did it.  Once we developed the technology to discover radio waves, hell, we made use of those too.  The standard of data storage, transfer, and analysis continues on an exponential path with no signs of physical limitation, economics both the driving force and the cap.  We kicked off a snowball effect as a species, and that is why we have been this successful.  Future discoveries will act as a lubricant for continued exponential advancement as they serve to bridge the gaps across scientific disciplines*.  Our ability to gradually foster ourselves into a greater being doesn't seem impossible with the continued study of microbiology and nanotechnology.
 
-Ben

* I waited a while to send this because I couldn't think of this word.

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 1:45 PM, Chris Landreth <[hidden email]> wrote:
My only research into technological singularity is the wikipedia and discussions like this, but I always liked this sentence from the wikipedia:
Hanson (1998) is also skeptical of human intelligence augmentation, writing that once one has exhausted the "low-hanging fruit" of easy methods for increasing human intelligence, further improvements will become increasingly difficult to find.
Because of that rationale, I don't think there will be a technological singularity.

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 3:57 AM, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
Is the existence of a single emotionless, omniexistent being
automatically governing all physics tantamount to nonexistence?  If
there simply is no traditional self-awareness or perception anywhere,
does anything really exist at all?  Is the eventual manifestation of
one wholly objective, all-knowing entity our ultimate weapon against
ourselves?

On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
> What is the drive for technology?  Is it vicarious immortality?  Do we
> want to live so long that we're willing to sacrifice our individual
> existences in favor of a single collective, self-generating force?
> Would such a transition be instant, or would our human identity slowly
> erode?  Will we be addicts to this erosion in the moment and only
> consider the short-term subjectively positive effects on our present
> generation?  At what point will this erosion become objectively
> positive?  Are we trying to invent God?  Will a Technological God
> eventually be able to overrule the laws of physics and ensure its
> permanent, though emotionless, existence?  Has this already happened
> in a greater level of reality that we're living in the microscopic
> fold of?
>
> On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Is true Artificial Intelligence possible?  If so, will a
>> "technological singularity" become possible at some point in the
>> future?  If so, how likely is such an event?  If it's possible for
>> computers to evolve unassisted, will the separation of races (humans
>> versus autoevolving machines) become too great?  Will humans become
>> obsoleted and die off?  Will computers be benevolent?  Would
>> coexistence be beneficial in some areas?  Will we integrate ourselves
>> into computers and slowly lose our sense of individuality?  Will we
>> lose our human traits of empathy and subjectivity to crude,
>> unforgiving logic?
>>
>> -Ben
>>
>

--
* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.



--
* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.



--
* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.
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Re: Re: ?

Gifv Suzwoxfwa
Here's another fun thing to think about.

Instead of considering the functionality of the brain as a whole, consider the functionality of each neuron in the brain.  Then consider replacing one neuron at a time with its silicon equivalent until the entire brain is replaced.  Now replace the rest of the body with machinery: what's the result?

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 5:08 PM, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
That's a lot to be coming from the people who recorded Mmmbop only a couple years before.
 
Then again (...), I tend to believe that human intelligence always has the ability to improve(!), and that lower fruit leads to the branches that lead to higher fruit.  As technology is improved based on our increased experimental knowledge, certain barriers seen as the physical limitations of today will become nominal in the future.
 
What evidence is there to support diminishing returns in our future technological improvement and scientific understanding?  So far, the human way has been to conquer that which we're abounded by.  All in all, we've come a damn long way.  The concept of electricity as power would've seemed impossible hundreds of years ago, but we harnessed it and made it ours.  Past that, the idea of a microprocessor would've seemed impossible, but we did it.  Once we developed the technology to discover radio waves, hell, we made use of those too.  The standard of data storage, transfer, and analysis continues on an exponential path with no signs of physical limitation, economics both the driving force and the cap.  We kicked off a snowball effect as a species, and that is why we have been this successful.  Future discoveries will act as a lubricant for continued exponential advancement as they serve to bridge the gaps across scientific disciplines*.  Our ability to gradually foster ourselves into a greater being doesn't seem impossible with the continued study of microbiology and nanotechnology.
 
-Ben

* I waited a while to send this because I couldn't think of this word.

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 1:45 PM, Chris Landreth <[hidden email]> wrote:
My only research into technological singularity is the wikipedia and discussions like this, but I always liked this sentence from the wikipedia:
Hanson (1998) is also skeptical of human intelligence augmentation, writing that once one has exhausted the "low-hanging fruit" of easy methods for increasing human intelligence, further improvements will become increasingly difficult to find.
Because of that rationale, I don't think there will be a technological singularity.

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 3:57 AM, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
Is the existence of a single emotionless, omniexistent being
automatically governing all physics tantamount to nonexistence?  If
there simply is no traditional self-awareness or perception anywhere,
does anything really exist at all?  Is the eventual manifestation of
one wholly objective, all-knowing entity our ultimate weapon against
ourselves?

On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
> What is the drive for technology?  Is it vicarious immortality?  Do we
> want to live so long that we're willing to sacrifice our individual
> existences in favor of a single collective, self-generating force?
> Would such a transition be instant, or would our human identity slowly
> erode?  Will we be addicts to this erosion in the moment and only
> consider the short-term subjectively positive effects on our present
> generation?  At what point will this erosion become objectively
> positive?  Are we trying to invent God?  Will a Technological God
> eventually be able to overrule the laws of physics and ensure its
> permanent, though emotionless, existence?  Has this already happened
> in a greater level of reality that we're living in the microscopic
> fold of?
>
> On 1/17/10, Ben P. <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Is true Artificial Intelligence possible?  If so, will a
>> "technological singularity" become possible at some point in the
>> future?  If so, how likely is such an event?  If it's possible for
>> computers to evolve unassisted, will the separation of races (humans
>> versus autoevolving machines) become too great?  Will humans become
>> obsoleted and die off?  Will computers be benevolent?  Would
>> coexistence be beneficial in some areas?  Will we integrate ourselves
>> into computers and slowly lose our sense of individuality?  Will we
>> lose our human traits of empathy and subjectivity to crude,
>> unforgiving logic?
>>
>> -Ben
>>
>

--
* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.



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* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.



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* You received this post because you are subscribed to "Lincoln and Beyond" (LAB), a relaxed, file-friendly discussion group about anything under the sun.  Most members live or have lived in Lincoln, Nebraska.  LAB was founded at Yahoo! Groups in September 2004 and moved to Google Groups in March 2005, where it has since remained.  To date, LAB has received over 49,000 posts from countless contributors.
* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.



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* To start a new thread on LAB, compose e-mail to [hidden email].  Replies can also be made to any thread, including this one.  To change subscription settings, visit http://groups.google.com/group/lincoln-and-beyond/subscribe
* Please note that LAB is actively archived, and all posts may be publicly accessible through search engines or by other means.  In other words, any and all LAB content is likely to never disappear.